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S06E12: America's First Zoo

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3:21 pm
September 2, 2010


Nosfer

Rotaredom

Moderator

posts 2957

One big long commercial…See Post 8 above.

Yes, it was "fetch", now if we could just get Kris and Amy to say "What the Fetch?", "That scared the Fetch out of me", "Did you Fetching hear that?", "Holy Fetch", and "Fetch" we'd be down to three bleeps a night.

Why is the footage on the thermal paused before it falls when they have the split screen when Jason is testing the door? It's running, it pauses, it runs, it falls.

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3:22 pm
September 2, 2010


Lindy

Guest

I hear "What the *bleep* was that"? countless times per episode and rarely (if ever) is any type of real evidence offered as a result. Sometimes the show sounds like a garbage truck backing up. (It smells like it too)

6:47 pm
September 2, 2010


Learjet

Australia

Lead Investigator

posts 1122

Yep, it's all the "did you see that?" "did you hear that?" that we never see that has driven us to ridicule. I remember even before I was skeptical of them, becoming increasingly more frustrated as they did that with the camera man pointed at the investigators instead of the thing that they saw. Finally after all these years we are getting shots with the camera pointed directly at what they supposedly see, only to reveal what we suspected all along, NOTHING!

IMO these people have hypersensitised themselves into such a state that every leaf that blows in the wind is paranormal. Every drop of water – paranormal. Every spider web – paranormal. Literally. Look at FoF. Mouse farts just don't do it for me anymore, so my frustrations have turned to being cynical. And why not? Six seasons, multiple show spin-offs, years of "ghost hunting" and they are still doing "shhh, did you hear that?". AARRRRHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They deserve some good ol' heckling! They have well and truly earned the right.

http://yfrog.com/0tstatlerwaldorfmuppetshoj

OD'd on EMF

8:15 pm
September 2, 2010


kevin

Louisville

Investigator

posts 54

Did anyone hear the music Grant and Jason were hearing? It seems like they would have made more of an effort to make sure we, the viewers, could hear it. If they both heard it (Grant describing it as a waltz) then it should have been recordable. I also wish they would have tried harder to find the source of the music. Oh well, I guess it doesn't matter that much since they didn't try to use it as evidence of the paranormal during the reveal (or did they? I'm not sure).

Along with all of the "did you hear that?" or "was that you?" I'm tired of the constant talking to, and asking questions of, any "ghosts" that happen to be in the area. I know they are trying to provoke a response, but isn't it as likely they are scaring off any supposed entities? When you compare the large number of questions asked with the small number of supposed responses, any direct response could be considered a coincidence. Just shut up and listen.

8:31 pm
September 2, 2010


Learjet

Australia

Lead Investigator

posts 1122

No I didn't hear the music in the tunnel, though I only have low quality video file to watch this time.

It is likely that the tunnel has a "focal point", much like a parabolic dish where any sound is greatly amplified at a certain spot. We see this in the show where they have to be at a certain point in the tunnel to hear it. What they hear could simply be a distant, amplified, external above ground sound.

While I'm debunking, I wonder if this zoo has any "mimic" type animals like Australia's lyrebird? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeQjkQpeJwY Our magpie and butcherbird are also quite skilled at mimicking things. Might explain the metal gates / doors sounds.

Really any audio evidence from a zoo is going to be contaminated by the wildlife.

OD'd on EMF

9:32 pm
September 2, 2010


Stephen

San Jose, CA

Admin

posts 589

emarie said:

I've asked this before on other sites but never have received an answer.  I've seen the comments poking fun at how they (GH, GHI, etc) use the phrases "Did you hear that", "did you see that?" and "what was that"…ibut n all honestly…what ELSE are they supposed to say? 


Hi emarie,

Personally, I'd like them to be quick and definite, and do the following:

  1. Start each sentence with a definite subject. (May seem nutty, but there are more people in that room than we see.)
  2. Specify a location, objectively, to look. Train on looking in clock directions.
  3. Instruct the camera operators to follow these instructions as well.
  4. Ask the other person what they see.
  5. Do NOT describe what you see.

So instead of "Did you see that?" (Meaning, "Do you want to agree that I just saw something weird?") say "Britt, doorway at three o'clock, check it." There are probably tweaks to make in terms of how to describe direction, because in a dark room you might not be able to see the other person clearly, but I'd want the other person to corroborate things as quickly as possible to make sure I wasn't seeing things that weren't there.

If I'm in a dark room, I'm more likely to see things that aren't there. If someone prompts me with "Did you see that?" then I'm more likely to take the latest perceptual error I just made and decide it's paranormal. I can join in with a tense "Yeah!" and be a great ghost hunter. If I happened to see something slightly different than what the other person saw, we can gloss over it or edit it out later. On the other hand, if I have to describe what's going on in the doorway at my three o'clock angle, then it's more likely to take a deliberate lie to make accounts match up.

Now, we tend to make fun of the words themselves, but part of what we're calling attention to is the general practice for ghost hunters to work each other up. Yelling "What's that?" in a tense voice makes the other person tense. That can affect the investigation and make people see and hear things that aren't there. So it's not necessarily the words themselves which are our target, but the investigation method that leads to them.

Stephen the Friendly Skeptic

11:51 pm
September 4, 2010


Stephen

San Jose, CA

Admin

posts 589

Posted my comments on the episode in the blog.

Stephen the Friendly Skeptic

8:43 am
September 5, 2010


Liz M

NY

Investigator

posts 30

It was definitely refreshing to see the "client" have a difficult time hearing the evp's.  I wonder how many takes it took for him to look slightly convinced.  Because he didn't look all that convinced to me, and since they weren't doing this reveal live, you know he had to have been coached to look somewhat suprised.

I think Kris got hit with a drop of water.  You can see water falling from the ceiling in some of the footage.  And right after she gets "touched" there is a dark spot on her shirt.  I would expect the dark spot to be a little more elongated if it was a drop of water, but it is possible.  Bug is also likely.

9:05 am
September 5, 2010


Nosfer

Rotaredom

Moderator

posts 2957

It's definitely a bug, it was crawling all over her front for several of the shots while they were down in the tunnel. When she drops her head after saying her hair was grabbed, you can see that several of her strands come down late. It's a brick ceiling mortared together…uneven cement can be very "grabby" I think it very likely that she WAS grabbed…by a completely natural, non-paranormal object. I wouldn't rule out a water drop, but with her hair doing that as she ducks, I would put my first bet on a "hair snag"

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2:35 am
September 6, 2010


Lindy

Guest

In his review of this episode Stephen writes

   "There were also some slamming doors. Have you ever noticed how ghosts on Ghost Hunters seem to have fads? In earlier seasons, ghosts apparently liked to lead Jay and Grant on chases through long corridors. Then, for a while, ghosts were murmuring to them in tinny-sounding voices. Nowadays they like to slam doors when no one is looking."

This got me thinking about those residual haunts where the spirit walks through the wall where there was formerly a doorway.

Do ghosts open and close doors?

Maybe only the organic ones do.

8:47 am
September 13, 2010


Orion

The Mundane Plane

Investigator

posts 105

Hey all, long time no talk! I'm still alive.

Well, investigating a haunted zoo.. now I've heard everything.

To be honest, I didn't watch it.  I never watch them anymore, unless I want a cheap laugh. I've given up on all the ghost hunting shows, they're all just ridiculous and painful to watch. Though I could watch Kris for a little while..Wink

FWIW, I live about 25 minutes from that zoo, (in NJ) and I've never heard any stories of it being "haunted".  They figure just because it's the oldest zoo in the country it might be haunted??

One question for Stephen: in your review, you said you calculated the resonant frequency of that tunnel at 18Hz, based on it's 45 foot length.  How?  Did you also know the height of the ceiling and width between walls? (I didn't see that in the link you provided) I mean, you can't determine a resonant freq based on just one dimension..

Having an open mind is a two way street.

11:06 pm
September 15, 2010


Stephen

San Jose, CA

Admin

posts 589

Orion said:

One question for Stephen: in your review, you said you calculated the resonant frequency of that tunnel at 18Hz, based on it's 45 foot length.  How?  Did you also know the height of the ceiling and width between walls? (I didn't see that in the link you provided) I mean, you can't determine a resonant freq based on just one dimension..


No, I used the closed-tube formula from the wikipedia page. I don't think it's a completely irrational approximation since the tunnel is so long, but I'll freely admit that I neither have a proper background in the subject nor am I willing to try to guess at the ceiling height and width. I was struck by the coincidence, but really I was giving the thing more as an example as something interesting that they could have investigated rather than a serious explanation of the ghostly figure. Even if the harmonics are right, we'd still need to figure out a source of energy.

Stephen the Friendly Skeptic

12:19 pm
September 22, 2010


Orion

The Mundane Plane

Investigator

posts 105

Stephen said:

No, I used the closed-tube formula from the wikipedia page. I don't think it's a completely irrational approximation since the tunnel is so long, but I'll freely admit that I neither have a proper background in the subject nor am I willing to try to guess at the ceiling height and width. I was struck by the coincidence, but really I was giving the thing more as an example as something interesting that they could have investigated rather than a serious explanation of the ghostly figure. Even if the harmonics are right, we'd still need to figure out a source of energy.


Ah, okay..  just curious if I missed something. 

I saw that they were going to do the zoo in previews (by coincidence, while I was channel surfing).. I thought, "no way".  It really is getting silly anymore. 

On the other hand.. they might not do private residences anymore for good reason;  they're "celebrities" now, I imagine there's a lot of unscrupulous folks (fans) who would make certain claims, and maybe even try to fake something, just to lure the team to their house so they could meet their TV heroes and get their 15 minutes of fame. 

I guess TAPS is running out of places.. and ideas.  I give the show one more season, then all these paranormal shows are dust in the wind.

Having an open mind is a two way street.

6:06 pm
September 22, 2010


Dreamsinger

Investigator in Training

posts 9

Lindy said:

In his review of this episode Stephen writes

   "There were also some slamming doors. Have you ever noticed how ghosts on Ghost Hunters seem to have fads? In earlier seasons, ghosts apparently liked to lead Jay and Grant on chases through long corridors. Then, for a while, ghosts were murmuring to them in tinny-sounding voices. Nowadays they like to slam doors when no one is looking."

This got me thinking about those residual haunts where the spirit walks through the wall where there was formerly a doorway.

Do ghosts open and close doors?

Maybe only the organic ones do.


The event of a residual with a spirit walking through a wall where a door used to be has me scratching my head in a few instances. One story I heard on a television show, described a person walking through the wall where an exterior door was. A no time in their description was the "ghost" described as opening the door. The people who claim to have witnessed this said the person simply walked through the wall.

Now, if residual hauntings are suppose to be a moment captured in time that keeps repeating, how is it out of the 15 or so stories that I've heard about, that have ghosts passing through exterior doors, not one mention the "ghost" moving as though they were opening a door and then passing through the wall. Several of these stories come out of the northern states where their doors are kept closed most of the time. Shouldn't at least one of these stories mention a "ghost" moving like they're opening a door before they pass through the wall?

10:30 am
September 23, 2010


Orion

The Mundane Plane

Investigator

posts 105

Dreamsinger said:

The event of a residual with a spirit walking through a wall where a door used to be has me scratching my head in a few instances. One story I heard on a television show, described a person walking through the wall where an exterior door was. A no time in their description was the "ghost" described as opening the door. The people who claim to have witnessed this said the person simply walked through the wall.

Now, if residual hauntings are suppose to be a moment captured in time that keeps repeating, how is it out of the 15 or so stories that I've heard about, that have ghosts passing through exterior doors, not one mention the "ghost" moving as though they were opening a door and then passing through the wall. Several of these stories come out of the northern states where their doors are kept closed most of the time. Shouldn't at least one of these stories mention a "ghost" moving like they're opening a door before they pass through the wall?


Probably.   Unless by sheer amazing happenstance, the doors were always open when those events were "recorded into the environment" as they say.

Another possiblity is that by "doorway", some people actually mean a simple passageway between rooms, like the way my kitchen connects to my living room.  There's no door there to speak of, but one might call it a doorway.  If walls were torn down or shifted about,  those might move too.

I know, I'm being generous.

Having an open mind is a two way street.

10:34 am
September 23, 2010


Nosfer

Rotaredom

Moderator

posts 2957

Inside a house I'd give the benefit of the doubt, but since "exterior" door was mentioned, well, that becomes less likely. A closed door is nothing more than a removable wall. Now, what about the possibility of the ghost being from before a time when the dwelling was even there? Yeah, generosity is running rampant on this forum today LOL

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