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HOW TAPS FINDS THEIR INVESTIGATIONS SITES

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2:40 pm
January 5, 2010


emma

Investigator in Training

posts 15

39

Thanks for your response, Revenant.  I think you make alot of good points about confirmation bias, the nature of the hard sciences, and experiment design in general. And I realize that I didn't make my case very well in the above-referenced paragraph.  To answer your question, I am trained in Biology, Philosophy of Science, and Psychology, but my practice is in experimental design for psychological phenomena.  I haven't read the other threads yet regarding confirmation bias- do you think you could point me in the right direction, so that I don't have to comb through every page in this site?  I am loathe to respond by saying things that have already been said (because of the obvious response that it garners), and I hope you do not honestly expect someone to read every page of this site in order to contribute to the discussion.

As far as the "sniping at each other" goes…

People here don't know my sense of humour.  They don't know me in the real world.  I am fully aware that my words (and ironic sarcasm) don't always translate well in writing, and for that reason, I sometimes feel like it is in the best interests of understanding to change the way something is written when it is brought to my attention that it is unduly offensive.  Why is it weird that I apologized for it in another thread?  It was brought to my attention there, and I responded there.  I honestly don't see how that is strange. 

Alicat seems all over the board, in that she doesn't stay on topic, and rather likes to pull quotes from a variety of sources in an effort to make some "point" that she never comes straight out and makes.  And honestly, after witnessing her behavior on a number of threads in these forums, I'm not especially interested in preserving her feelings, and don't care if she has a problem with the honesty of my "panties in a bunch" remark.  She jumps to alot of conclusions about peoples' motivations, and sets people into the defensive immediately by expecting them to answer to her as to why they are here.  I don't know her, and I could be wrong, but she seems rather territorial.  I find that highly inappropriate, and don't mind saying so.  It seems to be her m.o., and while I'm not going to make a huge deal out of (like she seems to think is her duty on this forum) I'm also not going to tiptoe around it.

I have seen plenty of "sniping" all over these threads (for instance, what do you think Alicat is doing in the above post- making assumptions about my motivations, implying that I'm not intelligent, repeatedly posting the comment that i chose to change?  why aren't you jumping all over her?)  People make a much bigger deal out of it when it is sniping on the long-term posters.  There is definitely a group-mentality thing going on here, almost similar to what everyone complains about on the SyFy forum.  It's rather more subtle, but every bit as pervasive.  In the nature of general discussion, I don't think it's appropriate to treat new people as idiots, to jump all over their every remark, or to demand that they state things the way YOU would have them stated- if I were so inclined, I could also read through individuals' various posts and call people out for rude, insensitive, or off-topic comments that were designed only for intimidation and not understanding.  However, I am interested in discussing the issues, not in discussing people's personalities.  

I have no problem being challenged, or having someone disagree with me, but to disagree in a way that shuts down discussion (to simply say: "i disagree; don't say that" without a logical and reasonable explanation as to the contrary) doesn't actually respond to the issue at hand and is simply stupid and immature.  You (royal) do not have to agree with everything I say, but to make a case out of a simple flip remark is antithetical to real discussion (as much so as making the remark was in the first place).  An appropriate response would have been, "I find that very offensive."  An inappropriate response is: "I don't like that, don't do it again."  Or what?  You'll kick me out?  Sounds like a power-play to me.  I could understand if I made a habit of it.  But a modicum of understanding woud be more appropriate, because I see alot of hypocrisy going on here.  If you like, I'll go through and find some of the occasions where long-term posters referred to someone as "retarded," or where there were clearly some disrespectful attitudes going on.  Like I said, it's not really my reason for being here, but if you'd like me to continue to make my case, I will do so. I rather think you could do that on your own, and see that my point is valid.

Unless you hold yourselves to the same standards that you hold new posters, you simply look like a bunch of authoritarian, hypocritical, and closed-minded individuals.  I had rather thought that you weren't, but the notion is becoming much more murky.


(edited only slightly and admittedly not very thoroughly-  for the sake of clarity-  i made it clear that "you" was a "royal you" and not YOU, revenant-  because otherwise i anticipate another backlash of B.S….  though i could be wrong)

4:00 pm
January 5, 2010


emma

Investigator in Training

posts 15

40

alicat said:

However, because I would not "debate" you in that thread, you came back and changed your above post and took a swipe at me.  Odd, how someone who "claims" to be so intelligent would, as you put it, make such a "flip comment". 


alicat-

could you please provide evidence that i posted these things "because you would not debate me" (i would absolutely love for you to try to provide evidence of my motivations, especially considering your assumptions are erroneous) and that i "claim to be so intelligent?"  you seem to jump to alot of conclusions in your efforts to "win" against me.  i am not interested in your pitiful little power struggles, but i see alot of claims here that are lacking any evidence, and quite frankly your hypocrisy is disgusting.  are you capable of letting this go and getting back on topic, or are you going to continue to make this a much bigger deal than it needs to be?

9:26 pm
January 5, 2010


Logisti

Admin

posts 177

41

Emma, Alicat, stop, please.

Emma posted some things, Alicat found some of those things offensive, Emma went back and changed some of those things — I was under the impression this was done in order to be LESS offensive, not to further rile Alicat or anyone else.

That being said, going back and removing offensive remarks from a post is a band-aid, the real solution is to make your posts more diplomatic to begin with, Emma — and having gone through a number of your other posts I see you are capable of this and hope you continue to spend the extra effort to do so, especially when discussing more sensitive topics. Alicat may be very vocal and her interpretation of your words and actions may be a bit intense but she is not the only one who has been offended.

I don't want anyone to respond to me or reference this post in any way. Just keep the above in mind as you continue posting.

10:06 pm
January 5, 2010


emma

Investigator in Training

posts 15

42

Thanks, Logisti.  I hope that your statement, "I don't want anyone to respond to me or reference this post in any way" was a suggestion to avoid further conflict and not a dictum to avoid any response.  I would like to say that I will, indeed, make an effort to be less offensive in the future.  Again, I do apologize for offending anyone with my initial remark. 

3:29 pm
January 6, 2010


Revenant

Lead Investigator

Hopelessly Locked In A "Fear Cage"

posts 942

43

First and foremost, I'm not exactly seeing what all of this has to do with TAPS and how they find their investigation sites, GH, or the paranormal in general.  Hmmm…another thread spiralling into the abyss…

Secondly, since emma's response was directed towards me, I shall respond…

emma said:

Thanks for your response, Revenant.  I think you make alot of good points about confirmation bias, the nature of the hard sciences, and experiment design in general. And I realize that I didn't make my case very well in the above-referenced paragraph.

You are very welcome.  When one claims that "hard science" isn't that good at experiment design…I get a bit cranky.  I'm pretty sure that I could find a couple of people to agree with me on that one…

emma said:

I am loathe to respond by saying things that have already been said (because of the obvious response that it garners), and I hope you do not honestly expect someone to read every page of this site in order to contribute to the discussion.

In a perfect world, I do expect someone new to read every post in every thread of this site in order to contribute to the discussion.  Yet, since the Chicago Bears finished at 7-9 and Dane Cook is still breathing…I am fully aware that this is not a perfect world. 

In the post that you are referencing, I simply said that it had been discussed before and I would sum it up, which I did.  No harm, no foul there.  What I do honestly expect from a new poster posting on an established forum (any established forum, not just this particular one) is to realize that most aspects of the topic have been discussed many, many times.  That perhaps what the new poster has to share is not new.  And that long time posters may mention that, sum things up in order to save time and maybe not be called out for it.  In most cases, I will post a link.  I simply chose not to in this particular case.

emma said:

People here don't know my sense of humour.  They don't know me in the real world.  I am fully aware that my words (and ironic sarcasm) don't always translate well in writing, and for that reason, I sometimes feel like it is in the best interests of understanding to change the way something is written when it is brought to my attention that it is unduly offensive.

I found this quite interesting.  You are aware that your writing style may be perceived as "unduly offensive" yet you proceed with it anyway and only change it when another must point out the fact that it is not be socially acceptable in that particular forum.  I'm sure there are some fancy-schmancy psychological terms to describe this behavior yet I am really not interested in hearing them.

As for the paragraph ranting about Alicat…a couple of things.  First, there is no point in arguing with you over it since it is your opinion.  Second, and more importantly…I do not see why that paragraph is not censored by the Admin.  I would think that is the poster-child for a personal attack.  The paragraph is simply thrown in to vent at anothers expense.  If it's not removed, I would love to hear why…

emma went on to say much more but could be summed up with this:

Unless you hold yourselves to the same standards that you hold new posters, you simply look like a bunch of authoritarian, hypocritical, and closed-minded individuals.  I had rather thought that you weren't, but the notion is becoming much more murky.

You seem to be under the impression that the responses geared towards you are related to your status as a new member.  I find this odd.  Let us use this thread as an example…

ghosthunterpat started this tread.  A new member and an actual ghost-hunter to boot.  She was polite and interesting and was met with general politeness.  Sure, some tough questions were asked, but it remained civil.  Mugs, who also posted in this thread, was also relatively new at the time.  His posts were polite, well thought out and literally brimming with interesting information.  I don't believe that he has encountered any sort of problem.

Now, let us examine your short stay.  You made references to peeing on a leg, smelling each other's farts, and panties being in a bunch.  Collectively, you questioned the SV's community's motivation as skeptics (fair, yet done in an annoying and insulting manner) and essentially called us "stupid, immature, authoritarian, hypocritical, and close-minded."  You even had time for a religious slur as well.  And you're wondering why you haven't been welcomed with open arms.  You're questioning why you haven't been elevated to Admin status and given a free t-shirt.  I mean…you know, really? 

Could it be…oh, I don't know and just throwing it out there…that your troubles here have nothing to do with you being a new member and have everything to do with your abrasive, aggressive, and combative nature?  You seem like an intelligent person and have a background in psychology.  You're honestly telling me that you have no clue in how your posts are being perceived?  That is what you're going with?  I find this very hard to believe.  We're smarter than that and so are you. 

emma said:

Like I said, it's not really my reason for being here, but if you'd like me to continue to make my case, I will do so.

If it is my choice…I chose "no."

Lastly…*sighs*…emma said:

(edited only slightly and admittedly not very thoroughly-  for the sake of clarity-  i made it clear that "you" was a "royal you" and not YOU, revenant-  because otherwise i anticipate another backlash of B.S….  though i could be wrong)

This totally lost me.  I do not know what "royal you" implies.  But beyond that…in the same post, you thank me for my good points and end it "i anticipate another backlash of B.S."  So my post contained good points but was ultimately "B.S?"  Nice. 

Please do not lump yourself in with the other new posters.  In the past year, we've had many intelligent, well-spoken and cool people join up and post here.  Many have not encountered the same reception as you and believe me, trust me, know this for a fact…it has very little to do with the SV community and how we treat new people.  Maybe it's time to stand up and take a bit of responsibility for your less than warm reception here.  I'm sure there are plenty of forums out there who would love you as a member.  They would give you a sweet title, bake you a cake, and nominate you as "Poster Of The Year."  Just seek them out.  You can argue there until your heart's content.  Who knows?  Maybe they'll even agree with you that psychologists are better at designing experiments than "hard science." Undecided  Enjoy the cake…

EDIT:  Nothing has been editted in this post.  I think before I post and I mean what I say.  I fully realize how it will be perceived and that perception is intentional.  I take full responsibility and will not change a word.  You know…the way it should be…

3:47 pm
January 6, 2010


blinddog

Moderator

"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"

posts 735

44

LOCKED.
Reason: Thread has gone so far off topic as to make it irrelevant.


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