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6:16 pm
December 11, 2008
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dr_peter_venkman
| | Rochester, NY | |
| Investigator | posts 99 |
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I've been wondering about the whole theory of EMF and paranormal activity. It seems that the cause and effect relationship has gotten twisted somewhere along the way. I believe there is credible research that shows high EMF can produce physical and mental effects in humans. These effects can manifest as uneasy feelings, nausea, etc. which can be misinterpreted as a "haunting".
Where or when did investigators leap from the research-backed theory that high EMF causes the perception of a haunting to the theory that ghosts cause high EMFs?
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Hee hee hee! "Get her!" That was your whole plan, huh, "get her." Very scientific.
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3:23 am
December 12, 2008
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Learjet
| | Australia | |
| Lead Investigator | posts 1122 |
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The leap is an easy one. You take along a meter to an investigation to find high readings from electrical sources which "may" give rise to the perception of a haunting (which most of the time I believe is baloney, but anyway). Every now and then though the investigator finds transient readings that seem to move or be free floating and then are gone. GHOST! See, it wasn't that hard.
Ingredients needed for the leap are 1) an investigator that knows nothing about EM fields, 2) knows nothing about ELV / VLF and the background noise, 3) knows nothing about how an EMF meter functions, 4) carries an EMF meter so basic that it only has a meter or a set of lights which tells little about anything. 5) Stir until investigator makes giant assumptions and bake until ghost is deemed to be the cause.
Cake anyone?
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4:38 am
December 12, 2008
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dr_peter_venkman
| | Rochester, NY | |
| Investigator | posts 99 |
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Learjet said:
The leap is an easy one. You take along a meter to an investigation to find high readings from electrical sources which "may" give rise to the perception of a haunting (which most of the time I believe is baloney, but anyway). Every now and then though the investigator finds transient readings that seem to move or be free floating and then are gone. GHOST! See, it wasn't that hard.
I agree that the (high EMF = perception of haunting) is weak at best. But if you look at the field as a whole, it appears to be the only semi-credible theory in a list of hunches:
1. Ghosts draw energy (heat, electricity, etc.) from the environment to manifest
2. Ghosts are attracted to limestone.
3. Ghosts can imprint on electronic audio devices.
4. etc.
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Hee hee hee! "Get her!" That was your whole plan, huh, "get her." Very scientific.
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6:36 am
December 12, 2008
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StanTheMan
| | Lincoln, RI | |
| Investigator | posts 89 |
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Dr V – don't forget the latest: Ghost like water
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7:33 am
December 12, 2008
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Learjet
| | Australia | |
| Lead Investigator | posts 1122 |
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I really think that most if not all of the EMF + ghost connection would be de-bunked if people that were properly educated in that field, using more advanced equipment were to research the subject. The average ghost hunter has neither the skill nor the equipment to do so. However if one really wants to the skills and equipment can be acquired.
When I first started exploring the connection between EMF and ghosts only a few months ago I knew little about it, other than what my amateur radio skills enabled me with. Then I got interested in natural Earth sounds and "listening" to ULF-ELF-VLF. The connection between those hobbies is the frequency band. The average EMF meter just happens to use the same frequency band as natural radio, more or less. For natural radio or Earth sounds receivers in the 100Hz – 10KHz range are used. Those that watch schumann resonances use DC to 100 Hertz and build very sensitive low noise preamplifiers and high Q antennas. The equipment is not expensive but it's incredibly sensitive.
Radio receivers are available that tune down to 0 KHz and spectrum analysers can be cheaply built to give a sweep from 0-24KHz simply with the PC's sound card input. I made a portable unit using Acer's eee pc and a coil of wire. Add a USB 7.1 channel sound device and it makes for an incredibly powerful portable "EMF meter" with high information yield and accuracy. There's a full writeup over at the TAPS forum along with screenshots. I just leave it running watching the background noise from the neighbourhood. Lightning, TV's, power tools, even cars leave recognisable signatures on the waterfall display. Suburbia is very noisy.
You can't be fooled with a hand held transmitter with this device, nor a mobile/cell phone, car keys or whatever. Everything on the display leaves a unique signature. If something is suspect the signature can be reproduced.
What does a ghost look like on it? That's a question I can't answer.
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10:53 am
December 12, 2008
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Bobarino
| | Valencia, CA | |
| Investigator | posts 181 |
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I agree that the jury is out on EMF, but a few years ago there was a show on Discovery or TLC about Alien Abductions. The actually did experiments with EMF with volunteers.
If I remember correctly, the volunteers (who were told they were studying experimants on brainwaves while sleeping), were fitted with a "helmet" that had numerous EMF radiating devices that could be controlled from a control room by the scientists.
During the night they put out different frequencies of EMFs until they found one that made the volunteer very uncofortable as if having nightmare. When they woke they spoke of having "out of body" eperiences similar to Alien Abductions. They did this test on a number of people with similar results.
They then equated Alien Abduction/Out Of Body "dreams" with people lving near High Power Lines, natural High EMF areas, etc.
Now, I don't remember much more than the above. Maybe someone else saw it and can fill in any holes I left out?
Conclusion: EMFs *could* make you think you saw something? But this test was done on sleeping subjects, not on people walking around awake so maybe it doesn't apply but thought I would throw it out there…
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I've found that being AWESOME is a full time job…
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9:48 pm
December 12, 2008
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Stephen
| | San Jose, CA | |
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Bobarino: I'm pretty sure the study you're referring to relates to one of Dr. Michael Persinger's experiments. He claims to be able to induce out-of-body experiences by applying electromagnetic fields to very specific areas of the brain. It's interesting stuff, and I think he's right.
However, the EMF that the Ghost Hunters are measuring is a very different kind of thing. Persinger's fields are very weak and patterned quite specifically. It's kind of like saying, "Hmm, classical music makes me relax. Classical music is sound waves. I should be even more relaxed if I stand in front of this fog horn, since it produces even more sound waves."
Many studies have tried to find EMF sensitivity. They've pretty much failed. (I researched it in another article.)
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Stephen the Friendly Skeptic
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7:53 am
December 13, 2008
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dr_peter_venkman
| | Rochester, NY | |
| Investigator | posts 99 |
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Stephen said:
Many studies have tried to find EMF sensitivity. They've pretty much failed. (I researched it in another article.)
Stephen,
Nice article. The results from the IEEE are quite telling. I've changed my original opinion and I'm now searching for another theory in this field that has a shred of credibility. Wish me luck.
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Hee hee hee! "Get her!" That was your whole plan, huh, "get her." Very scientific.
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8:36 am
December 17, 2008
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Haephiteus
| | Taylor, MI | |
| Investigator | posts 54 |
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I have an interesting one….
Using a good old compass, I was standing still and all of a sudden got the feeling of dread, and looked down to see my compass going nuts. It lasted about 3 seconds. Nothing was caught on video, digital stills or audio. I have been to this place several times and never experienced this. However I had picked up a very impressive EVP from there.
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You are a god among insects. Never let anyone tell you different. ~Magneto
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2:56 pm
December 17, 2008
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dr_peter_venkman
| | Rochester, NY | |
| Investigator | posts 99 |
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Haephiteus said:
I have an interesting one….
Using a good old compass, I was standing still and all of a sudden got the feeling of dread, and looked down to see my compass going nuts. It lasted about 3 seconds. Nothing was caught on video, digital stills or audio. I have been to this place several times and never experienced this. However I had picked up a very impressive EVP from there.
I'm not sure what to make of your experience but a good old-fashioned compass is an interesting device for investigations. I would think that it would be easier to eliminate potential sources of false positive readings since they are limited to relatively strong magnetic fields relatively close to the device. This could make hoaxing more difficult and therefore evidence more credible.
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Hee hee hee! "Get her!" That was your whole plan, huh, "get her." Very scientific.
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4:11 am
December 18, 2008
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Learjet
| | Australia | |
| Lead Investigator | posts 1122 |
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That certainly is interesting. There are theories that ghosts create DC magnetic fields. These will also set off an EMF meter if they are moving and show a very specific spike on my spectrograph, like this moving magnet. The registration spikes are way down at the bottom "DC" end of the spectrum, tapering off in strength as the frequency increases.
 
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