The Forum [is where Ancient Roman skeptics hang out.]

Current User: Guest Login Register
Please consider registering


Lost Your Password?

Residual Hauntings

Reply to Post
UserPost

12:28 pm
August 28, 2009


The Doctor

Lead Investigator

posts 488

Supposedly, residual hauntings are when Casper acts out the same sequence, over and over without regard to any outside influence.   I recall Grant saying that " They don't even know we are here "

Well, since they do the same thing in the same place, where is the problem with leaving cameras, perhaps live internet cams, pointing at that area 24/7 ?   All sorts of equipmnent could be left in the path of the Ghostie, but since they were first noticed by people using their normal eyes and ears, standard cameras and audio equipment should work fine.

Over a period of time we should be able to capture multiple copies of the event, with all types of sensors  from every angle.

Curious … Now that we have the technology, it appears the entire "residual haunting" concept has disappeared.

8:30 am
August 29, 2009


Learjet

Australia

Lead Investigator

posts 1122

Remember in a few threads past you were saying that Casper might be directly manipulating the electronics for EVP or EMF meters rather than using detection by normal means?

Well, maybe Casper upon manifestation generates a type of, let's call it "G wave modulation" which directly manipulates our brain chemistry / electrical activity to produce an image in our head without showing up on modern video equipment. Direct Unconscious Modulated Brain, or DUMB for short, may yet explain many un-photographed manifestations, residual or intelligent.   

Further, when Joe Chin sees a ghost, that's DUMB, Jason sees a shadow – DUMB, Grant feels a tug on his leg, also DUMB. Laughing

OD'd on EMF

9:32 am
August 29, 2009


Angelayo1970

Guest

This is something that I've been thinking about that I've never seen addressed anywhere, and I'd like some other thoughts on this. People have often talked about thermal images of ghosts and how, since ghosts supposedly are indicated by cold spots, they wouldn't leave a heat signature on a thermal imaging camera. My thought is this: if ghosts manifest by drawing energy from things, this would explain "cold spots" to me because they are drawing the heat or the energy away from the location in which they are trying to manifest. And if indeed they are made up of energy, why wouldn't they leave a heat signature on a thermal imaging camera?

This is just something that I've thought about quite a bit and I'm interested in hearing if anyone has any kind of input on this line of thinking. Unlike Ashley on GHI, I'm not very scientific and I'm not sure if "physics" can explain a lot of things (LOL) but this somewhat makes sense to me in a weird, convoluted sort of way.

Thanks for letting me ramble! :)

9:35 am
August 29, 2009


blinddog

Special Agent Zombie Elimination Agency

Moderator

posts 857

Interesting theory Learjet.
Instead of transmitting the 'G Wave' though the air to affect our brain, like a radio wave, say that it had to send the electrical signal to us though an opening in our physical body, nose, ears, mouth, etc.
Therefore if a ghost were to approach us from behind and accessing the most convenient body opening would the result be as thus:
Joe Chin sees a ghost, that dumbass, Jason sees a shadow, another dumbass,
Grant feels a tug on his leg, still a dumbass.

To test this theory of spiritual entities use of body openings to cause manifestations I would like to suggest to GH or any paranormal group the following procedure on an investigation.

1. Use of goggles to protect the eyes from entry.
2. Ear plugs, for same reason.
3. Face mask to protect nostrils.
4. Ball gag in mouth in case energy gets by face mask.
5. Butt plug to protect from rearward penetration.

J&G, if you were to follow above mentioned procedures and saved it for your 'Live Show' I can almost assure you a ratings bonanza for your time slot.

Double tap to the head. Don't become Undead.

3:18 pm
August 29, 2009


Wallydraigle

Ohio

Investigator

posts 114

I have a couple problems with residual hauntings.  First off, I've seen all over where people put forth ordinary iron oxide as a storage medium for a RH, and liken the process to an everyday VCR tape.  The playback mechanism is invariably a mystery.  The problem I have with this is that we already have vast repositories of known iron oxide recordings, and they never, ever, mysteriously playback on their own.  If they did every video store would be residually hanted by Sex and the City and Barney and Friends.  Which just doesn't happen, and we can all be thankful for that.

And other people say that strong emotions get imprinted directly onto whatever materials happen to be present at the time.  Besides the playback problem, when you start really looking at things closely, everything is in constant flux.  Say you had a RH in the woods or on a battlefield, and whatever essence which produces it is imprinted onto trees and earth and stones and whatever other outdoor things are there.  But trees and plants die and are replaced, stones are weathered away, worms and other organisms move soil around, rain washes things away, leaves and twigs decay, etc.  Even in, say, a stone building where a RH is supposed to be happening, the air and water permeate and diffuse through the stones, which chemically change over time.  There's a lot going on even if it looks the same.  Anything out in the open like that would make a very poor storage medium, because even if it was certain you could use it for the kind of complex replay of a RH, it would be more and more hopelessly distorted as time went on, and some of these things are supposed to be hundreds or even thousands of years old.

And then there's the theory that RH is somehow imprinted directly onto space-time.  But the earth is constantly moving and the sun and even the whole Milky Way are moving at thousands of miles per hour.  Every point in the whole universe is constantly moving in relation to every other point, so it's impossible to know if you're ever in the same absolute point as you were before.  If a RH was imprinted onto space-time, it would be replaying out in interstellar space somewhere, and nobody would know.

I can't logically reconcile residual hauntings with what I think I know about the rest of the world.

2:23 am
August 30, 2009


Revenant

Hopelessly Locked In A "Fear Cage"

Lead Investigator

posts 1393

Angelayo1970 – Hello and welcome.  We touched upon what you were asking about in another thread some time ago and can be found here.  The thread starts off about EMF meters but about half way down it switches gears.  Check it out when you get a chance and if you have more questions, just ask in that thread.  Not sure if we'll have any answers, but at the very least, we can give it a shot.  Smile

Wallydraigle – Excellent post.  You covered pretty much every point that I was going to make, save for the one which was my weakest point…so thanks for that.  Tongue out

One of the aspects about the "RH" that I've never been able to wrap my head around are the stories or actual descriptions of the RH itself.  The lion's share of reports are basically people essentially just walking around.  Didn't one description in a GH episode actually describe a ghost stopping to get a drink of water from a "ghostly" water fountain?

Why I am bringing this up is the almost universally accepted theory in the paranormal community that a ghost is "created" from tragedy or intense physical interaction with something.  A good percentage is either being murdered or committing the murder.  If you follow through with that, shouldn't a RH be based upon those experiences?  Shouldn't the RH be of someone running for their life?  Or someone with a knife constantly stabbing a bed?  Why is it the RH is always of a mundane nature?  If you think along these lines, shouldn't a RH really be a bit more spectacular to see?  Instead…we hear "the woman that was killed here is often seen entering the kitchen and making something on the stove?"  Really?  That is what is being replayed on, as Grant is often fond of saying "kind of loop, it just keeps playing."?

Residual hauntings have never made sense to me, then again, neither do intelligent hauntings…so, not sure where that leaves me… 

"Skepticism is not a position, it's a process." -Dr Michael Shermer

2:35 am
August 30, 2009


Lindy

Guest

Wallydraigle said:

 " Besides the playback problem, when you start really looking at things closely, everything is in constant flux.  Say you had a RH in the woods or on a battlefield, and whatever essence which produces it is imprinted onto trees and earth and stones and whatever other outdoor things are there.  But trees and plants die and are replaced, stones are weathered away, worms and other organisms move soil around, rain washes things away, leaves and twigs decay, etc.  Even in, say, a stone building where a RH is supposed to be happening, the air and water permeate and diffuse through the stones, which chemically change over time.  There's a lot going on even if it looks the same.  Anything out in the open like that would make a very poor storage medium, because even if it was certain you could use it for the kind of complex replay of a RH, it would be more and more hopelessly distorted as time went on, and some of these things are supposed to be hundreds or even thousands of years old."

I like it Wallydraigle, it just makes too much sense and keeping in line with Learjet's and BD50's theories about DUMB and DUMBASS, we can label these types of hauntings as "Residual Energy That Always Repeats Despite Endless Dissipation" (RETARDED)

When Jay explains that "Me and Grant seen" but once again failed to capture on film what they like to refer to as a "Residual Haunt"  it's RETARDED.

10:05 am
August 30, 2009


The Doctor

Lead Investigator

posts 488

Lindy said:

When Jay explains that what "me and Grant seen" but once again failed to capture on film is what they like to refer to as a "Residual Haunt"  it's RETARDED.


It's the failing to catch it on film that's their biggest problem.

A quick google search shows that the belief by investigating  groups is that most hauntings are residual, yet none of them are able to obtain any solid repeatable evidence.

A residual haunting should be a sitting duck to a hunter, no matter how amateur they are.

ESPECIALLY if you own the buildings and can setup hidden security cameras and microphiones in any of the public areas.

10:36 am
August 30, 2009


alicat

Lead Investigator

posts 1215

@ The Doctor -  I have to admit, your words "sitting duck to a hunter" are quite appropriate.  A duck hunter can sit for hours on end waiting and watching a particular spot because they know there is a history of ducks returning to that area.  Eventually they will see ducks because they have prepared themselves for the opportunity they know is coming.  The only thing different in the equation, as you have pointed out, is the advent of technology which is making the residual haunting a hard sell.  To me, it's a duh! moment.  If you know it's coming, why not use that technology?  Then again, I'm the person who takes a train that uses updated technology and should run on time but still hopes to make it to work on time.

3:50 pm
August 30, 2009


Angelayo1970

Guest

Thanks Rev, I will definitely check out that thread. I am a newbie here, so I'm trying to play a LOT of catch up. I really appreciate how thoughtful and helpful everyone on this site is, such a different experience from the majority of forums out there, especially where topics of the paranormal are concerned!

I do have a thought about the seemingly mundane nature of most reported RH's. If a spirit left an imprint due to the release of adrenaline or energy because of a traumatic or tragic event, is it possible that the "mundane" activity that is imprinted could be a retelling of their activity just preceding the event? Obviously there's no rational way to know that, and of course, to say that it's too traumatic for the spirit to relive the violent event over and again would point to an intelligent haunting. And if you really want to go out on a limb, who is to say that some of what paranormal investigators type as RH's aren't really intelligent hauntings, but the spirit has no interest in making contact with those present, and therefore is just "going about their business". We all know private, reclusive people in real life. If they came back as a spirit after their death, isn't it possible they would have the same personality traits they did in life?

Oh, and the DUMB, DUMBASS and RETARDED "theories" actually made me, truly, laugh out loud! Thanks for the entertainment! :)

4:01 pm
August 30, 2009


Sheetie Attitude

Investigator

posts 50

Angelayo1970 said:

If a spirit left an imprint due to the release of adrenaline or energy because of a traumatic or tragic event, is it possible that the "mundane" activity that is imprinted could be a retelling of their activity just preceding the event? Obviously there's no rational way to know that, and of course, to say that it's too traumatic for the spirit to relive the violent event over and again would point to an intelligent haunting.


The thought of spending the rest of eternity reliving the violent or tragic event leading to my death would pretty much be my best possible explanation of 'hell'. 

5:34 pm
August 30, 2009


Angelayo1970

Guest

I couldn't have said it better myself Sheetie!

8:14 am
August 31, 2009


HollyDolly

Investigator

posts 194

Angelayo1970 said:

This is something that I've been thinking about that I've never seen addressed anywhere, and I'd like some other thoughts on this. People have often talked about thermal images of ghosts and how, since ghosts supposedly are indicated by cold spots, they wouldn't leave a heat signature on a thermal imaging camera. My thought is this: if ghosts manifest by drawing energy from things, this would explain "cold spots" to me because they are drawing the heat or the energy away from the location in which they are trying to manifest. And if indeed they are made up of energy, why wouldn't they leave a heat signature on a thermal imaging camera?

This is just something that I've thought about quite a bit and I'm interested in hearing if anyone has any kind of input on this line of thinking. Unlike Ashley on GHI, I'm not very scientific and I'm not sure if "physics" can explain a lot of things (LOL) but this somewhat makes sense to me in a weird, convoluted sort of way.

Thanks for letting me ramble! :)

No that's actually a very good theory and at least to me, makes sense.I have heard TAPS say on the show, that the ghosts draw energy from the surrounding area in order to manifest themselves. Not that they are experts by any means, but I have also seen other paranormal groups say the same thing.So if a ghost draws energy from its surroundings to manifest, then indeed it should appear warm on the thermal.Now, what law of physics they use, or how it exactly happens,I don't know, but your theory makes sense.

As far as residual hauntings,maybe it's not a haunting per say. Maybe somhow there is a time slip, and events sometimes replay themselves. Let's say you have an old abandoned house in the neighborhood or out in the country, a big house. Then one day, you drive by, and the house looks newly painted and kept up. So you remark to one of your neighbors or old Gerite, the waitress at the local restaurant , about how your glad to see someone fixed up the old Wigglesworth place. How it was all nicely painted, etc. Well everyone there thinks your nuts, cause no one has purchased the property, and it's still run down.So feeling like a fool for people laughing at you, you go and drive past there.As you do, you realize everyone was right.

 However, you still believe you saw the place in it's glory days. That's like under the Cops and Ghosts thread, Hasmat Kid has posted some interesting stories about Liverpool ,England at the TAPS18 Forum. He is a professor at the University of Liverpool. One of the stories is of a ghostly funeral procession that has been seen going down one of the streets, complete with a horse drawn hearse and carriages of mourners. He has mentioned some other things too about Bold St.How visitors and police have reported on occasion seeing people dressed like the 1940s and the shops are different.Very interesting.

 There was a famous english battle, I think the battle of Monmouth, in any case, people in the area were able to watch the battle replay it's self.Many witnesses recoginzed people fighting in this, including Prince Rupert, who was still very much alive at the time.That's why I think it's more of a thing where, for whatever reason, there is some sort of slip , when these events of the past come through from whatever part of the universe they go to,and come back into our world. I'm no expert of course, but some scientists say there are other dimensions besides our own, which is one of the theories that maybe Bigfoot and other such creatures or strange beings like shadow men,etc. are able to come to our world, through holes or portals opening from their dimensions into our own.

Though I kind of put Bigfoot more in the cryptoid realm, as we have foot prints and such.


8:17 am
August 31, 2009


HollyDolly

Investigator

posts 194

Oh by the way, in my post above, the waitress is named Gertie, and Wigglesworth is a real last name.

I took it from Carl Wigglesworth, a San Antonio radio Personality.

8:38 am
August 31, 2009


Nosfer

Rotaredom

Moderator

posts 2956

Angelayo1970 said:

This is something that I've been thinking about that I've never seen addressed anywhere, and I'd like some other thoughts on this. People have often talked about thermal images of ghosts and how, since ghosts supposedly are indicated by cold spots, they wouldn't leave a heat signature on a thermal imaging camera. My thought is this: if ghosts manifest by drawing energy from things, this would explain "cold spots" to me because they are drawing the heat or the energy away from the location in which they are trying to manifest. And if indeed they are made up of energy, why wouldn't they leave a heat signature on a thermal imaging camera?


Actually your cold spot idea is one I've brought up before a time or two here and over on the TAPS board (when I was a member) Exactly right, the cold spot SURROUNDS the entity, it is the result of the energy being sucked out of the air around and to feed the entity.

This particular FLIR that they use is useless for non-solid objects, though. Gasses etc will not show up on it unless of a high enough concentration…and I mean very high. That's also why I feel that a single thermometer is insufficient and why I've proposed the array method where many recording thermometers are set up in a tight grid. Can we detect a cold spot followed immediately by a warm spot…the cold spot being the leading edge of the entity, the air around it being sucked of its energy, and then the warmer core the entity itself? Who knows, but no one else that I know of has tried this, and my own experiments have had no willing entities cross the array so I have no data one way or the other on the temperature relations.

Angelayo1970 said:

Thanks for letting me ramble! )


Not a problem…you'll fit right in with that tendency sometimes! :)

Legal: The content of this post is copyrighted and is intended exclusively for use on skepticalviewer.com It may not be copied, distributed, or redisplayed on any other site without the express written consent of the author.

11:05 am
August 31, 2009


The Doctor

Lead Investigator

posts 488

HollyDolly said:

One of the stories is of a ghostly funeral procession that has been seen going down one of the streets, complete with a horse drawn hearse and carriages of mourners. He has mentioned some other things too about Bold St.How visitors and police have reported on occasion seeing people dressed like the 1940s and the shops are different.Very interesting.


Which brings up an interesting point -

London alone has over 100 "Jam Cams" operating 24/7 http://www.bbc.co.uk/london/travel/jam_cams/index.shtml

I have not heard of any residual haunting sightings from ANY street cam anywhere in the world yet.    You would expect someone to notice a ghostly funeral procession, or maybe they drive right through them ?


6:05 pm
August 31, 2009


Angelayo1970

Guest

I think the array of thermometers idea would be very telling, but of course we will never see anything like that on any of our favorite "paranormal television programming" because…hmmm…IT JUST MAKES TOO MUCH SENSE! LOL

4:31 am
October 28, 2009


gman26

Investigator in Training

posts 11

Maybe there are things which although can be experienced simply cant be measured scientificaly or understood by physics. Or just maybe humans are to dumb to figure out how. Were quite a fledgling race when you think about it.

9:21 am
November 30, 2009


AbsoluteTerrorField

Charlotte, NC

Investigator in Training

posts 23

The idea of using a grid system of various instruments is a very good idea. One that personally I would try to use given the chance. I guess that's why I'm not so popular with paranormal groups. I prefer good use of logic without jumps to conclusions that fit preconceived notions. Maybe one day we'll get the chance to see a group use ideas other than waving misused equipment around yelling for cold spots and a very hot figure prancing around in a hallway. That is of course unless all of us at SkepticalViewer couldn't get our own show…hmmm….

Reply to Post


Reply to Topic:
Residual Hauntings

Guest Name (Required):

Guest Email (Required):

Smileys
Confused Cool Cry Embarassed Frown Kiss Laugh Smile Surprised Wink Yell
Post New Reply

Guest URL (required)

Math Required!
What is the sum of:
12 + 6
   



Permalink Print
Copyright 2010 SkepticalViewer.com - The Ghost Hunters Fansite for Skeptics