January 16, 2008
GHI: Lucedio Abbey
The GHI (Ghost Hunters International) team headed over to Italy to investigate a millennia-old abbey that was apparently used for some pretty heinous executions and whatnot in the name of religion, and supposedly not sanctioned by the Church at the time. Right away Brian started seeing shadows, specifically moving towards Donna. For her part, Donna said she felt like someone had grabbed her shoulder at one point and later on during the night that something had touched her arm. Barry apparently also saw some of these shadows, but nothing was caught on camera.
Shannon was clearly scared out of her mind, standing by herself on one side of the room essentially acting as bait — but she kept it together and Robb did a good job recognizing her for the strong effort. Unfortunately, not much else happened except at one point during the evening the entire team was in one of the rooms when they all agreed they heard someone whisper, "Go, now!" — since everyone claimed to have been silent at the time it was decided to have been paranormal in origin.
During the evidence review Robb found that piece of audio and it did appear to have the word, "Go" in it, but then it was cut off and Robb explained that after that someone had breathed directly into the microphone and nothing else was audible, but since the entire team had heard it he felt comfortable labeling it as evidence of the paranormal. This is what I would call, in not-so-technical terms, a "bad move".
The production audio was obviously being recorded microphones elsewhere in the room and they caught the entire episode quite clearly. It might help to explain here that when this incident occurred, the entire team was trying to find a shadow that Brian had said was moving towards Donna and then backed off and moved around the perimeter of the room. To my ears the production audio seems to have clearly captured, "go… where are you?" and it in-fact sounds very much like Brian to me. It would certainly make perfect sense for him to be muttering, "Where did you go? Where are you?" under his breath at that point in time and perhaps he wasn't muttering loug enough for anyone to hear until he got to the word, "go". Also, as a side-point one would suspect a ghost living in an Abbey in northern Italy might not necessarily speak to intruders in english.
Now, even if that is the case I suppose it's possible Brian himself didn't realize he was talking under his breath but frankly his antics elsewhile during the investigation had me wishing some horrible fate befell him. He and Barry were running through a bunch of crypts which were, by all available evidence, empty but he just kept going on about his bad feelings and announced upon leaving that there was definitely something evil inside that did not like their presence. Seems like a rather cavalier attitude for an investigator supposedly approaching things from a skeptical, scientific standpoint.
A pillar that supposedly wept tears for the many tragedies that had occurred there (accused criminals were aparently strapped to it or stod in front of it while awaiting judgement) also came up completely dry (pun intended) and really there is only one piece of evidence the team turned up that wasn't a complete joke. Their guide Paolo had told them he had stayed in a room there as a child and had heard voices during the night, so the team decided to place an audio recorder in that room. At evidence review the team got extremely excited about what they heard on the tape, and Pilgrom even edited it so the audience would have to wait until the end of the reveal to hear it.
It was one word. At least the word was in Italian. On the recording it does seem that someone clearly says, "Basta" which is Italian for "Enough" or "Stop". I don't believe the team really spent any time in that room or that any of them even spoke Italian (although at one point Barry attempted to communicate in some basic Latin) and "Basta" is a complex enough word (two syllables plus the "st" sound) that it would seem unlikely to have been caused by interference — still it's exponentially less convincing than it would have been if accompied by even a single other word.
All in all, this investigation did little more than aggravate me, especially where Brian Harnois is concerned. I really wish the team would make a habit of reviewing the production crew's footage when they have any evidence that was captured while a production crew member was nearby. It's been done once, so it's not impossible.
Filed under Ghost Hunters International, Posts by Logisti
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Comments on GHI: Lucedio Abbey »
bill kelly @ 12:44 am
ok, i'll start at the bottom and work back. this might go long.
i'm glad i'm glad i'm not the only one irratated with brian. i was so glad he left GH. he sees/hears something EVERYTIME out. and someone posted here he said dave tango had no hunting experience. hello? jay/grant are plumbers. donna worked i believe p.r. for large company. lisa is a vet. kris worked as a construction worker, gunshop, actress. NONE of them studied the field in college.
i have always wondered why they NEVER use production footage for proof - best example was when they lost audio due to someone pulling the plug before saving after grant heard his name. oh yeah. what true GH would not be saving evidence as they go or right after finishing before packing up?
now, i also wondered bout language barrier but also something else. i'm a definite product of the 1980s and look to back to the future for the answer to this question. if anyone of us traveled back in time, with 2008 technology, how would people look at us? my bet is like when marty mcfly was wearing his vest. why, especially on GHI, dont they ever say "this machine is not to hurt you" or something like that. last time i heard a GH say something like that was lulabye lane. before that? tombstone maybe.
even evil spirits i assume would wonder what the heck a camera was or mic. let alone the sound equipment. am i just overthinking this? seems to me since we dont see ghosts everyday, that they wouldnt want to go near people with such strange contraptions. just think if we went back to 1955 with a dvd, laptop and video camera.
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Logisti @ 1:00 am
Funny you should mention the word "contraption" there because it just reminded me of an EVP TAPS got somewhere (I forget what episode/location) that was alleged to say, "What is this contraption?"
Now, without making any judgements on whether that was actually being said, or if the entire thing was just an interference pattern imprinted on a cheap voice recorder, it's clear that TAPS was impressed and believed the voice was asking, "What is this contraption?" in reference to one of their techno-gadgets. You would think that would be a big tip-off for them to start talking (to the supposed spirits) about their equipment, but they don't.
It's another flaw in their investigation method: they don't consistently learn (or inference) from their experiences and so even if "ghosts" do exist they're not regularly improving their investigation techniques and therefore improving their chances of getting some actual, good evidence.
One of my favorite truisms is this: The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Well TAPS (or anyone else, for that matter) has yet to deliver any convincing evidence of the paranormal, and if paranormal phenomena really do exist they're going to have to try new investigation techniques — some of which should already be obvious, such as explaining their equipment. Who knows? It might just improve their odds of getting a "ghost" to actually come out and play on camera.
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CrowTRobot @ 12:20 pm
I,too, get tired of (A)everything happening 'just off camera'; (B) "something's here, let's get out"; and (C) Donna - what a waste…..an annoying waste.
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Andy O @ 2:01 pm
I too am very sick of Brian. It always seems like he sees soemthing every time he is doing a investigation. Brian really annoyed me last night when he was in that tunnel. As far as we know it could have been a rats that moved in front of him. When he said it was following him out, it could have been the echo of his crawling as fast as he could out of there.
It seems as though Robb does a good job at trying to debunk things and they actually showed a little more last night in that area. It still seems like to me that he is trying to hard to be the "leader" that Jason and Grant want him to be.
As far as Donna goes it seems like she was scared as soon as they went into the Church area. In my opinion if you go into a place thinking paranormal things are going to happen you lead yourself into chalking up everything that way. Barry didn't help the cause either when he said he saw a large black figure coming toward her.
When they go into these places over seas shouldn't they bring someone in that can actually speak the language. You can't tell me that they don't have any paranormal investigators in Italy. Not sure if that would help but how in the heck are Italian spirits from hundreds of years ago understand what a bunch of Americans are saying. Just a thought.
All in all the best evidence I thought was when they were in Paulo's room when he was younger.
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bill kelly @ 7:09 pm
Since there's not a new post fdor GHI i'll use this one
since i found this board, i've begun watching for things written about on here for both GHI and GH.
1. they never move the camera so we can see what they see-in the jan. 23rd GHI, Donna kept seeing shadows, but the camera stayed focused on her. in a repeat of the Florida lighthouse, the same thing kept happening.
2. brian continues to see things noone else does, but this time Robb calls him out for running to scene without camera.
3. in GH, do we need to hear EVERY show how Steve is afraid of everything but Ghosts?
my doubts are increasing bout this show
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Anjie @ 2:46 pm
When I first saw Andy on GH, he got on my nerves a lot. Now though, I'm really starting to like him. I'm almost at the point with him that if he sees/hears something, I believe him. Brian has passed being the boy who cried wolf. I swear, I think if that guy closed his eyes he'd swear there was a shadow coming at him. So annoying.
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GHI: Ghost Hunting Idiots @ 9:16 pm
I cant believe what this show has gotten to. They see shadows but they just look around and do not even try to record it. I always wonder why the production cameraman doesnt turn the camera towards where the investigator is looking. Why do we have to watch the investigator? To see his fear?
Andy is ok. Brian is horrible and so is Donna. I hate Brian's cockiness and his know it all attitude. You never see him carry a camera around just a EMF detector and its not the most reliable piece of equipment. Also you'd think they'd have more cameras by now?
This show is a joke now. They see their own shadow on the wall and they scream "look a shadow!" and then follow it for the whole episode till someone says "time to pack up."
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Shawn @ 9:45 pm
I have to admit one of the biggest problems with GHI is the chemistry among the cast. Donna never struck me as having much personality during her tenure on GH and she really adds nothing to this show. Barry seems to be a bit of an oddball and Shannon runs for cover when things start to get hairy. As for Brian, it baffles me why they would bring him back when it seems he got on everyone's nerves while with TAPS. You can't go by anything he says as it's so evident he wants to prove a haunting and not the other way around.
And then there's Robb…Jesus, could they have picked a bigger dullard to be the leader of this group? If the head cheese has no charisma or magnetism about him then how is the show going to keep it's viewers?
I still stand by my prediction that this spin-off won't last more than two seasons (if that).
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bill kelly @ 12:03 pm
Shawn
great commentary. Donna is better behind the scenes. Shannon adds nothing. she lives in city near where i went to college. i bet she uses these shows just to be local star. couldnt agree more on brian. guy sees ghosts in his sleep. barry is bizare. he also sees things that arent there. loved it when both got lost recently. not an andy fan and robb? yeah.
but look GH. do we continually need to hear bout steve being afraid of everything but ghosts? kris is easy on the eyes but has no skills at all. grant and jay no longer seem to be as ….dedicated? not sure of right word but they have certainly lost many hunters over the yrs.
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the Muse @ 3:59 pm
I'm actually not annoyed with Brian as everyone else is. I found him amusing if nothing else.
I actually do like Barry as well even though he does a ton of running around with the "I feel evil" bit! This can be annoying but he's an interesting hunter to watch in action.
Robb is interesting as well as he appears a skeptic but he's also somewhat irritating to me as he puts off an air of self importance. Maybe it's just me.
Donna rubs me wrong. I dunno what it is about her but I find her completely and utterly unbelievable.
Shannon is a flake and seems the odd one out.
All in all it was an ok episode but failed to wow me. I was enjoying the historical factors of the show but aside from that it seems as much as a hoax as GH.
Oh well.
I find Donna deeply annoying as she always seems
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dj rock @ 10:57 am
i love ghi i watch every time it comes on
i say ghi does ther best so if you dont like them,keep it to yourself
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Logisti @ 11:19 am
I understand your sentiments, and if we were evaluating GHI as a sitcom I would agree with you, however we are evaluating it as a "reality" program that conducts "scientific" experiments.
Due to the nature and relative importance of science and reality (and the fact that they choose to label themselves in that way) I don't feel it's unfair to criticize the team when they don't meet the minimum standards.
If the show recasts itself as a sitcom I would be happy to hold them to those newly appropriate (and much lower) standards.
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Kaleena @ 9:11 pm
Ah, don't get me started on GHI. I use to be a die-hard GH fan and thought that GHI would be up-to-par (if not better) than GH. I realized after the first episode that GHI was nothing more than an attempt to get rid of the riff-raff investigators from regular GH while Grant, Jason, Steve, and Kris did investigations in the US.
GHI is a crock-of-bull. Every episode, they left with what seemed to me as unconclusive evidence but they always labeled every place visited as "haunted"! I watched almost every episode, but it was only because nothing else was on on Wed. nights and I kept hoping against all odds that something substantial would occur. Nothing did!
As for GH. This season has yet to wow me. Maybe it is because I recently discovered that SciFi has another show, called UFO Hunters (or something like that), that is EXACTLY like GH, except they trying to search for extra-terrestrial life. It is filmed exactly like GH. I guess I was so disillusioned until recently into thinking that GH was a reality show not created by a network, but by real people truely interested in a hobby. This new SciFi show has caused me to have less faith and credibility in GH. How much of what the team finds is true hauntings and what is created by SciFi in order to make good t.v.?
It just goes to show that if you want the truth, you have to find it out for yourself!
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Rock Ruckson @ 7:07 pm
Its what we call in the field as Mental Masturbation
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babydraco @ 9:22 pm
Mental Masturbation. That's an accurate term as GHI was and GH has become a substitute with all the anticipation and none of the satisfaction of what is real. That's the consequence of relying on "reality" television.
I was amazed to read all of the comments that reflected the feelings so accurately similar of myself and my husband. Brian is a waste and Donna is the same, showing more of that on the GHI series. Rob was pompous and too full of himself to do any real research in worrying more about "looking important".
GHI got to the point of too ridiculous for me to even watch past the first few episodes. I do enjoy the historical aspect also, but even that could not keep me watching.
GH is entertaining. I enjoy watching Dave and Kris, but everyone is right in saying its lacking in "the wow factor". The show is not what it used to be and you're left wondering how much is fabricated just for ratings.
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numyer @ 9:44 pm
I was the same as some have mentioned here about GHI. Started out I was very interested, if not just for the wonderful locations, but got to the point where I just didn't watch the final episode because by that time I thought the whole cast were just ridiculous.
Communicating in modern "slang" type American in places said be inhabited by ancient European spirits. Shannon's reason for being on the show seeming to be that she was basically scared of her own shadow. A couple of times members of the investigating team acting macho like they were going to "kick ghost butt". And on….
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HollyDolly @ 12:47 pm
I remember when this place was twice on Scariest Places on Earth.The first family wound up leaving,and the second one stayed.Yes they could try to learn a little of the language.Surely they could right out some questions in Italian with the help of someone working at the hotel they stay at or with the help of the owners of the place. Even if their attempt wasn't the greatest,at least they tried.
The place has a rather interesting history,and they could have mentioned how the place came to be haunted like on Scariest Places on Earth.
In the footage from SPOE,with the second family,you saw a baby cradle from the 17 or 18th century rocking by itself
and by the way the family members who saw it weren't i recall in total darkness,seems to me it was pretty well lit,the room was. This was caught on video as it was happening.Wondered at the time whether the production crew rigged it,or the cradle was doing it by itself.
Also,the production company had cameras around the area,so in one scence were a couple of the ladies were in the domitory where the monks slept, one of them said she felt something hit her leg,this happens a couple of times.I believe they caught one of the beds moving.This was in total darkness.
Yea,brian can be a chowder head sometimes for sure.Robb not sure,but he seems to take things seriously.The girls I'm not sure on and Barry,well he's okay in his own way.I think being Irish he takes the possibility thatspirits aren't always nice and believes many of the legends and tales of his own culture.Just watch the episode at Lisheen Ruins and Leap Castle for Ghost Hunters.I think he has more respect for spirits than Brian does with his provoking,which I think may back fire one day and he gets bopped in the nose by a ghost.
Yeah one does get tired of hearing about Steve's fear of flying.I though Steve was a police officer ,seems that was mentioned once on GH.I hate to say it because it makes me laugh.If he is a cop,your dodging bullets everyday,never knowing if the guy you pull over has a gun or whatever.
My dad was a flight crew chief and airplane mechanic during WW2 participated in the raid on the oil fields of Plostei,Romania.He didn't tell his commanding officer "Oh I can't fly cause those nasty Nazi planes are shooting at us".
He just did what needed to be done, did it for 33 years for the Airforce.
Don't get me wrong,i love Steve,but he really needs to get some help to get over this.
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ryan @ 11:30 pm
Whenever i watch this show, if they hear something, the music is always just loud enough for us to not hear anything, they never find anything either. I also hate when they do the whole breifing part, like when their at work and then they get a phone call from taps, and why must we sit through the whole analysis.
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Bad dog @ 11:48 pm
All this stuff is all for a TV Production, fear sells, remember the blair witch project, yes it was only to sell fear. I watch all these shows as well and I find they have no proof what so ever to prove anything, real paranormal investigators do this totally different than what you see on TV, so just think its only a TV Production and fear is what there selling.
I have read all about the lucedio abbey and no where can I find murders or anything bad happened in this place, all the monks were moved not killed and the place was empty for a long time and renovated in the late 1800's. As it is now I read its nothing but a rice farm today. So lots of old tales that the locals keep alive, why because fear sells.
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Bad dog @ 11:54 pm
Ohhh I also found that they give tours of this place everyday and lots of people go there, check out the link here and go on a tour of a not so scary place..
http://www.principatodilucedio.it/inglese/vieni.html
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lisa @ 11:59 pm
Changing the subject for a sec, when scariest places on earth investigated Waverly Hills Sanatorium in Louisville Ky., In the morgue they (the show) rigged up one of the doors and body slabs to make the slab shoot out and the door slam. Such a waste because on a tour that i have taken there we were shown where they drilled and how they did it. I have no faith in that show at all. As for GH. Brian pain in the ass and such a fake, Glad he is gone. Jason and Grant love them at times. Tango good guy, Steve big coward. Donna she is okay…at times.
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Mnem @ 12:19 am
I watched a few of these tonight.. must say - lucedio was just a staged event - nothing real there.
The weeping column is interesting - but most likely due to the under bog, humidity levels, the airflow of the building, and barometric pressures.
GH or whatever it is - have never been impressed with the show.
I often wonder if the people who "talk to spirits" when they hear any little noise ever feel stupid later.
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Daniele @ 5:43 pm
Hi, i'm Daniele and i live in Vercelli i saw the show in television and the Lucedio's Abbey is much famous in the province, one night me and my friends visit the near abandoned cemetary, i felt some particular and strange emotions, the cemetary is abandoned but the smell inside is the same that a normal cemetary with fresh rose flower.
There's another site near Vercelli is a sconsacrated church in a little town named Saletta, near this church there are trees that if you count is different if you count in another ways….
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Michael in San Francisco @ 4:41 pm
It's all pure fiction edited for television, IMHO. The gullibility I see relative to GH, GHI and MH and their viewers astounds me. This is the 21st Century, right? I'd love to see Skeptic magazine evaluate this popular commercial trend towards ghosts, superstition and plumbers practicing the pseudo-science of the "paranormal."
Until then, I suggest authentic skeptics check out the web site: http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/ to keep their thinking orderly. I admit to watch GH occasionally but I do so purely for laughs.
Mike in San Francisco
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bullerspoke @ 12:37 pm
To state it is all fiction is about a unsound a statement as it is not. I've said it before, just because you can fake anything on TV does not mean that you do.
And as far as ghost belief being arcaic, well, that's an opinion not a fact. And heavily relient on modernistic thought I might add which does not make it true by default, rather the opposite. But primarily, it is an opinion.
Authentic skeptics, you say? I presume that you by that mean skeptics who agree with you. I am a skeptic, full-blown, but since that implies intellectual honesty I must entertain the possibility of ghosts, since it's neither a proven nor disproven fact. It's not about gullibility, it's about open enquiry and good science.
I don't want to believe, I want to know. Ghosts should be a matter of fact, not belief. What I believe or not is largely irrelevant, it's the facts that matter.
Skeptics like you and believers are essentially the same, two sides of the same coin. I prefer to be on the fence. All else is self-delusion. And bad science.
With that said, GH and GHI are indeed pseudo-scientific in their methods, but that does not mean we viewers have to be. J&G:s credibility is everything but solid, but again, facts is what matters. I take GH with whole kilos of salt, but to outright dismiss everything just because it doesn't jive with your opinions is just, well, narrow-minded.
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Oubliette @ 5:24 pm
Daniele-thanks for the comment on Lucedio. Sorry I didn't see it sooner.
That area has far too many stories surrounding it for something not to be going on. It's very creepiness must have some psychological effect, at the very least.
bullerspoke: well said. I am a skeptic also, but I cannot close my mind and think we know all there is to know about anything in the universe. (And if we did, wouldn't that be boring?) Actually, those who won't leave their mind open are really non-believers who are just as close-minded as their "believe anything" counterparts.
"I don't want to believe; I want to know". An excellent statement. As for me, I want to know just what did go on in the house I lived in as a child. I want to know what, if anything, is causing disturbances at the Covenanters Prison and the Black Mausoleum in Edinburgh, where quite a number of people have ended up cut, bruised and ill.
I believe your summary of what a skeptic should be is dead on. After all, the mind-body debate has been going on since the time of the Greeks, and probably earlier. Perhaps hauntings will, in the end, tell us more about how our own brains work then any remnant of an afterlife. But we'll never know unless we try to discover the truth.
The only pity is that the rash of recent shows is not helping any. There is really no reason why paranormal research should remain the stepchild of science. But try convincing people after watching, say, Paranormal State. These shows are dragging scientific hopes down, not helping to advance this very new field of human endeavor.
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Dr. Peter Venkman @ 7:25 pm
Just some bullet points -
Barry " Ghosts don't only speak in English" - Good point, how about having someone who CAN speak in the expected language ask the quesitons and review for EVP's ?
Donna's camera goes dead again
Now they are measuring ions and humidity(!) for presence of ghosts ?
Barry and Brian are crawling around the crypt get scared and rabbit - the poor cameraman is left behind to get a shot of their elbows and butts as they bail.
Two single word EVP's make it an official haunted location now ?
In the series opener, Robb says "I will dismiss any evidence that I personally cannot prove as paranormal"
Didn't take long to tear that up and toss it …
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